No thread about GM recalls?

[Fast One]

Makes the Corvair look safe.

Actually, the whole Ralph Nader deal about the Corvair's handling was pure BS. The issue was with drivers who were unfamiliar with the handling of rear-engined, RWD cars & how to drive them properly. '65 & later Corvairs with the Corvette-inspired full IRS handled as well as many & better than some sports cars of the day. Back when, I owned a '65 Corsa with the quad-carbed 140 HP engine, Z17 handling package (performance suspension & quick-ratio steering box), and a 4-speed stick. With a set of Konis & some decent rubber, that car was excellent in the twisties. Handling was very similar to my brother's '73 Porsche 911. I smoked a few 'Vettes in the corners with that car.

Here are the facts regarding the supposed Corvair handling issue:

A 1972 safety commission report conducted by Texas A&M University concluded that the 1960–1963 Corvair possessed no greater potential for loss of control than its contemporary competitors in extreme situations. The U.S. Department of Transportation (DOT) issued a press release in 1972 describing the findings of NHTSA testing from the previous year. NHTSA had conducted a series of comparative tests in 1971 studying the handling of the 1963 Corvair and four contemporary cars—a Ford Falcon, Plymouth Valiant, Volkswagen Beetle, and Renault Dauphine—along with a second-generation Corvair (with its completely redesigned, independent rear suspension). The 143-page report reviewed NHTSA's extreme-condition handling tests, national crash-involvement data for the cars in the test as well as General Motors' internal documentation regarding the Corvair's handling.

NHTSA went on to contract an independent advisory panel of engineers to review the tests. This review panel concluded that "the 1960–63 Corvair compares favorably with contemporary vehicles used in the tests...the handling and stability performance of the 1960–63 Corvair does not result in an abnormal potential for loss of control or rollover, and it is at least as good as the performance of some contemporary vehicles both foreign and domestic."

Car and Driver magazine criticized Nader for ignoring drivers' failure to adapt their driving and vehicle-maintenance practices to the characteristics and requirements of the Corvair. None of the issues Nader raised were problems among owners of the Porsche 911, which had the same layout and similar suspension, nor with the less powerful Volkswagen Type 1 Beetle.

Journalist David E. Davis, in a 2009 article in Automobile Magazine, noted that despite Nader's claim that swing-axle rear suspension were dangerous, Porsche, Mercedes-Benz, and Volkswagen all used similar swing-axle concepts during that era.

Joel

[Z28SSMAN]

Good article Joel. It's funny, Dan chimes in about my lack of coverage of GM recalls, but he doesn't point out that I didn't post Ford's latest recalls. I just don't have time to post all of em.

[DNeinstadt]

Just heard about another one. I'm just saying that most of the time you post the Ford ones like Chevy's are superior, I'm just returning the favor. :)

Wouldn't want this site to get TOO Chevy heavy....

http://money.cnn.com/2014/05/15/news...all/index.html

Dan

[Fast One]

Good article Joel. It's funny, Dan chimes in about my lack of coverage of GM recalls, but he doesn't point out that I didn't post Ford's latest recalls. I just don't have time to post all of em.

Now that is funny! :lol:

Regarding the perpetual car-wars on here... The recent GM recall is a big deal, no doubt. But Ford & Chrysler have also had big ones, as have Honda, Toyota, and others. Besides, with so many of Ford's models getting a pageful of black circles from Consumer Reports, the guys who bleed blue certainly have nothing to brag about these days. Ditto for the diehard Mopar guys.

And then there's the media. Remember the big Ford Explorer/Firestone tread separation deal? Many people in the media pointed fingers at Ford, claiming that they knew the Explorer was prone to rollovers. The reality? A subsequent NHTSA investigation showed that the Explorer was no more likely to roll over after a tread separation than any other SUV. The problem was that Firestone chose to take the cheap route when they designed the tire, by eliminating the usual nylon 'belt edge layer' that essentially eliminates belt edge separation. This caused the tires to be prone to tread separation due to heat buildup in the steel belts. Firestone claimed that the tread separations were Ford's fault for recommending a tire pressure that was too low. But Ford recommended the same tire pressure for the Firestones as they did for the Goodyears that were built to the same spec. The Goodyears did have the belt edge layer, and none of them ever suffered a tread separation at the same pressure.

Hmm....

.......Wouldn't want this site to get TOO Chevy heavy....

Dan

LOL! Might be a bit late for that. :camaro smiley: :harrel smile:

Joel

[Z28SSMAN]

Just heard about another one. I'm just saying that most of the time you post the Ford ones like Chevy's are superior, I'm just returning the favor. :)

Wouldn't want this site to get TOO Chevy heavy....

http://money.cnn.com/2014/05/15/news...all/index.html

Dan

Well, Chevs ARE superior.

Chev 283,302,327> Ford 289,302
Chev 396> Ford 390
Chev 427> Ford 428
Chev 350 >Ford 352
Chev 454> Ford 460
Chev LSX> Ford modular motor


Flame suit on

[Z28SSMAN]

Oops....I wouldn't have posted this if Dan hadn't encouraged me to...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/ford-r...175949876.html

[Fast One]

Well, Chevs ARE superior.....

Adding to your list....

NHRA manufacturers' cup championships:

GM ---- 42
Chevy - 19
Ford --- 6

NASCAR Cup manufacturers' championships:

GM ---- 45
Chevy - 37 (including the last 11 in a row!)
Ford --- 16 (including one win by Mercury)

Joel

[DNeinstadt]

Oops....I wouldn't have posted this if Dan hadn't encouraged me to...

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/ford-r...175949876.html

I just wanted to point out that GM has some recalls too. I figured the Ford ones get pointed out enough on here. ;)

Dan

[Z28SSMAN]

Oh...ok.